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- This topic has 9 replies, 4 voices, and was last updated 7 years, 7 months ago by KngLenny.
October 20, 2015 at 4:23 pm #2836shapebeforemovementParticipant
I haven’t shared much input on the forums so far, but I have watched many of you transition from “traditional to usrpt”, it’s hard for me to type “traditional” because I’m not really sure what that is anymore! I created this thread to allow other to share a workout, possibly give some input of what they were working on and or allow others to share thoughts on it! Also, I would be interested in trading a week’s worth of workouts with anyone via email, just send me a quick note at email@example.com here’s my workout from last night with some results from two athlete’s one male one female.
10/19/15 – Focus is to work on front end speed and back-half speed of 200 free & stroke, also aerobic back-half average of 200 free.
200 Choice WU
2 x 25 Choice Scull – 2 x 25 Choice Up Tempo @ 1:00
8-12 x 25 Fly Drills (simple to complex – finish with focus on distance per stroke)
3 x Thru (1st Free / 2nd Primary / 3rd Choice)
4 x 25 @ 1:00 (Make Faster than 1/4 of 100 Goal Pace)
1 x 100 @ Max Effort (Faster than 200 Goal Pace)
200 Choice Recovery + (5 x Turns of same stroke – increasing speed)
Dryland about 15 minutes (TRX Shoulder Retractions / 5 Sec Negative Pushups / Streamline Lunge to Squat Jump)
12 x 50 Free @ 1:00 (Holding 200 Pace)
500 Cool Down (include 75 sculling, 100 backstroke, 50 weak stroke with focus)
Male (17) 25’s @ 10.7 free average & 12.9 back average / 100’s @ 54.3 free & 1:03.9 back / 50’s @ 26.6 average
Female (14) 25’s @ 12.7 free average & 16.9 breast average / 100’s @ 59.7 free & 1:14.6 breast / 50’s @ 29.6 average
? Practice Technical Skill's and Make Fast a Habit!October 27, 2015 at 1:43 pm #2842
We recorded 50s @1:00 with partners timing every repeat on Wednesday. The amount offered was 20. Had a girl go 29.5 or faster for 19 out of 20. She’s usually closer to 30.0 or high 29 when there isn’t a partner timing every single one.
Also recorded 50s @2:00 for back half of 100 pace and my top girl was swimming 27.2 or faster for all of them. A few 26.9s. I could see her bringing her 100 back in 27.5-27.8 at sections but it would be insane if she came back in a low 27. Her times on these sets have dropped a ton throughout the season. It was considered a good set last month when she was holding under 28.5.
If we’re going off of her 25s @1:00 for her first 50 she’ll be out in 25.7. That would maker her potential splits 25.7 and 27.2 for a 52.9. I’ll be a very happy coach if she can do that when we rest.
My top 500 swimmer went 42×50@:50 before first failure holding 32.0 average. She got to 54×50 before 3rd failure. This was a big confidence booster since we only try to hold 32.2. I’m hoping she can hold 32.9 on her middle 50s in the 500 when rested and go 5:22. My more realistic guess would probably be 5:23.
"Most people have the will to win. Few have the will to prepare to win."October 29, 2015 at 7:55 am #2848dmueckeParticipant
I coach a group of 8-11 years old kids.
In general we swim 1-2 sets per session w/o hard target times. I instruct them only to swim fast and hold the time through the set.
At the beginning of each session we watch swim clips I prepared at home. They show normally a part of a swim stroke in an endless loop. I tell them the key points and after 2 mins they close their eyes to visualize the stroke. Then I tell them to jump in the water and swim exactly like the olympians in the video.
Also I always try to bring some fun in the session. I.e. When we do wall kicking I ask some trivia questions and for every wrong answer they have to kick as fast as possible for 15s.October 29, 2015 at 4:09 pm #2849
Yesterday we did 3 sets, long to short.
Set #1 = 16 x 50 (1) 1/4 200 pace, average made was 9.
Set #2 = 24 x 25 (40) 1/4 100 pace, average made was 11.
Set #3 = 12 x 25 (1) 1st 50 of 100 pace, average made was 8
I have a tracking question. For instance, when we did the 24 x 25 we had 4 mulligans. I don’t really have my swimmers pay attention to their times there, mostly focus on technical skills to get themselves mentally ready for the rest of the set. So in essence we did 4 x 25 preset and 20 x 25 “live” We track the 1st miss, and the knockout miss. From that I get their total number made, i.e. last miss number 18, missed 3, sat out 2 (1 after first miss and one after second miss) so 18-5 is 13. To this point I have been saying they made 13, should that number really be 9 (13-4 mulligans)?
If that is the case, then our numbers minus mulligans change to averages of 6, 7, 4 respectively which seems worrisome, even knowing that many of the swimmers make some or most of the mulligans.
Looking at those numbers including the mulligans they seem okay (correct me if I am wrong) with 9 = 2.25 race distance, 11 = 2.75 race distance and 8 = 2 x race distance (or 4 x race distance because it is a first 50 focus). Aren’t we looking to swim 3 x race distance at race pace, on average (including mulligans) we were just a little short.
Please critique/criticize any and all of my rambling.October 29, 2015 at 5:56 pm #2850
We’ve always counted mulligans as part of the total. As you said about your swimmers, most of our swimmers make their mulligans. It’s just so much easier this way. We have a goal of completing 4x race distance before first failure. So 16×25 @:40 beofre the first failure is considered good for our 100 swimmers. Out top 2 girls can do that easily many days though so I’m not sure doing them @:40 will give exact correlation to the 100 they swim at Sections.
Our top 2 100 girls did a recent test set where the top girl went 30 straight 25s @:40 holding 13.1. We’ll see if she can go mid 52 at sections. She was 55.3 last year so that’d be a crazy drop for a senior girl.
Our next girl went 22 straight on :40 holding 14.0 or faster. She went to 37 before her 3rd failure (when I say 37 I mean that is the number that was done at that point but really she sat out twice before then so it would be 33 that were swam). I just record the number that the set was at when they failed out. I know what it means so I don’t think it is necessariy to do all the subtraction. So much simpler to just mark “first fail occurred here, third fail occurred here. let’s go further next time.”
I expect the second girl to hit her pace and break 56. Her best time is 57.40 so she is swimming far faster than her actual race pace at this point. I’m hoping for a miracle swim and a 2nd place finish at sections. I just don’t know what is going on with her 50s @2:00 because she just never goes great times on them.
Do you have a particular example of a swimmer and what her best tapered time is and how she is training?
"Most people have the will to win. Few have the will to prepare to win."October 30, 2015 at 1:48 am #2853
Yesterday is bad example, of my two returning girls one missed most of practice for a midterm and the other told me at end she was/is sick when I asked why she had such an off day (thought I was going to need to give her some extra recovery).
So far my top girl is a tough nut to crack, she was 54 mid as a jr in high school and slower her senior year. As a freshman last year she was 55 low doing traditional training. She is swimming faster this year in meets so far, 25.4 and 56.5 in our last meet. She is currently training at a 56.0 pace. The problem we run into is at 14.0 she generally misses 1 or none but at a faster pace she can’t seem to put together a good set, usually is done around 12 including 4 mulligans. The other girl is having a much harder time adjusting, similar times at the end of the year 24.6/55 low and was 25.6/57.2 at our last meet. However she is training at a 14.3 pace and usually is at or below the average for the group, but who knows how long she has been battling this illness.
We are still transitioning and they are working hard to figure it out. But they are the recipients of a coach who is still figuring it out so we are still looking for that “groove”. A feshman girls who’s top time is 56 high is training at 57 pace and has God and bad days.
A better example are my guys, they are all pretty much training at very close to their best time paces we are still working on building volume. My top guy was 47 high last year as a sr in high school. He trains consistently well at a 48 low pace, I think he made it to 21 yesterday, so he completed 4x race distance total. However his times are not translating in Meets yet, he is consistently 50 low (22 low in meets this year, best time of 21.6) I think it is an adjustment and body composition thing right now, he is heavy with muscle and is really flagging on the back end.
The best translation is iny 200 strokes which are all guys. They are training at best time speeds and generally making it close to the offered 16 x 50 or finishing the set, but have yet to make it to two completions in a row. Their training times are 203 and they have been 207,207 and 209 (out way to hard in 2 fly last 50 we all saw the piano fall). So 207 is within half a second of 3% of their lifetime bests.
Thus far my biggest struggle is finding a consistant microcycle or weekly plan to follow, and that is on me but the last 3 to 4 weeks has been about adjusting, building to speed and now building volume. We have meet tomorrow so that will give me more data, but I plan on working on aicrocycle that we can consistently use moving forward (adjusting as needed) to beore consistant. The problem I run into is most are training for 3 or 4 events. Right now I leaning towards something like this for my 50-100-100 stroke, we do other skill sets, I just list them because they are at a high speed is 4 x 4 turns at race pace or 12 x 12.5 focustomers on breakouts.
Monday 50-100-100 stroke
Tuesday skill-100 stroke-200 free
Thursday skill-100 stroke-200 free
My other thought was to break it up by 50 and 100 days
Monday 100-100 stroke-200
Tuesday 50-skill-50 stroke
Wednesday 100 stroke-100-200
Thursday 50 stroke-skill-50
Friday 50 skill 100 or 200
Anyway that is a long ramble, hope that gave you some insight. Do you think I should be slowing down their paces and offeringore or keep the paces closer to best time and take the weeks needed to build volume. I was more inclined to build volume because our big meet isn’t until February. We will rest in a couple weeks for a midseason meet, but that isn’t nearly as important, it’s more about experience in preparation for February.October 30, 2015 at 4:37 am #2854
I would lean toward building volume at faster paces. I never like to have them slow down if I can help it.
My top 100 girl was going 58 almost all season last year even though she was training at 55.0 pace. She did hit 57.41 one time during the season but even that is 2 seconds off what she was training for. She wound up going 55.3 at sections so pretty close to pace.
I think if you are within 2 seconds of the time you want for a 100 you are doing okay. Are the times from the meets you sited with or without tech suits?
This year if I go just off of what she is swimming in practice for 25s @:40 she is really training 51.8-52.4. Best swims were this week (almost 3 months into season) at 54.29 and 54.65 tonight. So for us if we get within 2 seconds (or whatever percentage that is) of our race pace for 100s we are doing pretty well. Really hoping she’ll be under 53.0 when we rest. It’s almost time.
I don’t know how she was able to come into this season and swim so much faster than last year. Maybe that it’s the second year in the system? More likely that she came in having swam this off season and last year she was coming in after 9 months of nothing. I think having done it before does help though because those first few meets were kind of rough last year for everyone.
"Most people have the will to win. Few have the will to prepare to win."October 30, 2015 at 1:45 pm #2855
All best times I posted were with tech. suits, all times from this year so far are without. Thanks for the insight, we will continue to build volume, though we have our biggest meet of the semester in 3 weeks, which we will do that 3-day rest for that oldschool helped me find via the search function. Quick side note thank you to oldschool that search function has had me all over this forum and I love it, all the information!!!!!!
Anyway, I don’t think we will see any major results until february with more training time, but we are hoping for season bests.
Again thanks so much, and if I remember correctly you have a bigger meet this weekend, so good luck.October 30, 2015 at 3:11 pm #2856
A lot of swimmers don’t give tech suits the credit they deserve because they want to believe it is all their abilities and not the suit that made them fast.
A lot of coaches don’t give tech suits the credit they deserve because they want to believe their magical taper is what made their swimmer drop all the time at the end of the year.
I believe a good tech suit gives a 2% improvement and that might be conservative. Depends on the swimmer’s body type. Just let my flyer wear her tech suit for our last dual meet of the year in her 100 back to go for the school record. It was a 1:01.70 and she broke it with a 1:01.3. Her time this year without a tech suit was a 1:03.5 (though that was coming out of the 200 free relay).
All I’m saying is your swimmers might be a lot closer to lifetime bests than you realize.
"Most people have the will to win. Few have the will to prepare to win."October 30, 2015 at 3:35 pm #2857
100% agree. Now if I can convince the kids……Also a lot of kids don’t give the tech suit credit, but you can see their race mentality change when they get to wear one, real confidence booster.
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